Comments on: More Ways To Get Apps on the iPhone – No Thank You! https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/ #1 Source for iPad, iPhone, iPod, Mac and AppleTV Thu, 14 Oct 2010 20:57:29 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.4.6 By: patrickj https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-18003 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:57:33 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-18003 In reply to sysrage.

"If Apple simple allowed another method but provided zero support to people that used such method, jailbreaking would not longer be necessary and everybody would get what they need."

If they were going to go that far, then I'd still argue that there would need to be a single new 'alternative' store – one with Apple's 'at your own risk' wanring plastered all over it or whatever they would require. A sort of Cydia for the non-jailbroken I guess. I could support that sort of concept. I would just hate to see things descend to where a user never knows if they need to go to the App Store, or a number of competing stores, or an individual developer's website.

That's where you get back to the Bad Old Days of WinMo and others – where casual users have no clue how to download a .zip, extract it, run an exe then sync your phone etc – many casual users are just going to pass at that point. It's not just the centralized point of sale that makes the App Store so compelling – it's how easy the entire process is for users of all levels. A few taps and they've got a new app on a home screen. No downloading .zip files that need to be extracted, no messing with installing themselves etc. – I think you lose a ton of sales and interest in apps by taking that simplicity out of things.

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By: patrickj https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-18001 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:46:51 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-18001 In reply to John Meadows.

I absolutely agree that the App Store – and its reviews process – has many major flaws, and have railed againist many of them in this blog – but I still would far rather aim for 'fixing' the App Store rather than seeing the distribution process become any more complicated.

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By: patrickj https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-18000 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:44:17 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-18000 In reply to John Meadows.

Ah, ok – thanks for clarifying.

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By: sysrage https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-17996 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:24:04 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-17996 I see both sides of this. Those of you against alternate means of distribution have very valid points. *IF* there was and always will be an untethered jailbreak available for all devices, I wouldn't argue for a second that Apple should allow alternate methods of obtaining apps. However, since Apple has chosen to be so incredibly restrictive, there absolutely needs to be some other method. Currently, the jailbreak community fills that need. It works very well, but anybody that has bought a 3GS or IPT recently that requires a tethered jailbreak can tell you there is a very real possibility of a convenient jailbreak not always being available. Whether it happens that way or not, that IS what Apple is aiming to achieve.

If jailbreaking ever becomes impossible or if the next device is restricted to a tethered only jailbreak, it will hurt the iPhone community a great deal. I understand there are an insane number of users that don't jailbreak and will continue buying apps, but there is an incredible amount of innovation that occurs with the jailbreak community. Maybe I'm wrong, but I believe if you cut that off, the device will quickly stagnate and that innovation will move other places. I personally will be delaying my purchase of the next device until I know I can have an untethered jailbreak. The iPhone itself is not at all the device I want without the use of many functions only available when jailbroken.

I kind of turned this into a pro-jailbreak response. But my point is, there needs to be an alternate method. If jailbreaking remains possible, I agree that there is nothing else necessary. If Apple simple allowed another method but provided zero support to people that used such method, jailbreaking would not longer be necessary and everybody would get what they need. I disagree with those of you that think it would cause as many problems as you think. Before the App Store revolution, yes you are absolutely correct. Now that it's built up as much as it is, 99% of developers are still going to use it for the very reasons you explained. It's easy. People will still use it a lot. The reason the 'fragmented' distribution was such a problem before is because there WAS no widely used and accepted central repository. Now it's there. It's convenient. As much as it needs to change, it's not going away.

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By: Mark H. Delfs https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-17995 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 16:50:42 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-17995 I prefer to just use webapps whenever possible. There's a good webapp directory at http://www.webappuniverse.com that has a lot of good stuff. These webapps are lightweight and aren't as flashy as a "real" app, but, there's no app store to deal with either.

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By: John Meadows https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-17993 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 12:29:04 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-17993 In reply to @vjk2005.

I don't think there needs to be a dichotomy between choice/control and utility; it would not be hard to combine the best of both worlds; for example in modern Linux distributions application selection & installation works in a manner somewhat akin to the App store (albeit not nearly as elegantly yet) and the user has a choice of software repositories to draw upon: the official repository, 3rd party, etc. The basic process remains just as easy.

And as long as the process for application acceptance in the App store remains opaque and inconsistent (think Google Voice or the recent Rogue Amoeba incident) , Apple runs the risk of some of the best and brightest developers choosing to develop for other platforms as time goes on.

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By: John Meadows https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-17992 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 12:17:54 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-17992 In reply to patrickj.

Sorry Patrick, I should have been clearer; what I meant to say was that there might have been more justification from a network protection point of view for controlling what could be installed on a phone when it was just a phone, but I really think that doesn't hold water any more.

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By: @vjk2005 https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-17990 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 07:11:11 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-17990 Patrick is right and the AppStore must remain the exclusive way to get iPhone apps. It will be chaos otherwise and a major pain in the ass for users. The thing is, when I hear an app's name today I can fire up iTunes today and be 100% sure I can find it on there with a simple and quick search. This is why it works; earlier there never was a central repo for apps that users could turn to, meaning I would have to wade through endless pages of search results containing different versions of the software hosted on different sites and different software vendors having their own standards of quality, design principles and payment systems. All this chaos is taken care of by iTunes which is why any idiot can pop open and find the app he just heard about in seconds, see up-to-date info on the app at a glance and pay via trusted zero-hassle payment system. The AppStore is more than just a store… it is a -standard- and it must continue to be that way. Besides, people who prefer choice and control over utility can always switch to another ecosystem like winmo that suits their needs better.

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By: Joe Wolf https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-17988 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 03:50:13 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-17988 I'm betting this topic turns rather quickly into a "Pile on Patrick" event. While that is not my intention, I feel that you are wrong on this issue. IF there were a way for "official SDK" apps to be aquired from sources outside apple, they (Apple) could stay away from apps that they don't want to be associated with for whatever reason. If the contract between Apple & AT&T requires Apple to reject a specific type of app, Apple disallows it in the Apple APP store, then the developer still has a chance to recoup his/her investment by distributing the app through other channels. I as an iPhone owner should not need to jailbreak my phone to run google voice. Also, this approach would allow iPhone owners to use apps that Apple (with good reason) wants to distance themselves from.

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By: patrickj https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-17981 Sun, 03 Jan 2010 02:02:30 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-17981 In reply to John Meadows.

Sorry, but I'll have to agree to disagree with you on this one. The App Store never existed during the pre-smartphone era – which to my mind ended many years ago (at least 5 or so). The iPhone has been a smartphone, and much more computer than phone, since its birth.

People have been able to use varied distribution methods on other platforms without the world coming to an end, and I'd agree it works well on the desktop – but the fragmented, open model failed to gain any real traction with mobile users. Again, as a long-time Palm and Windows Mobile user, I can clearly recall how crummy the app distribution arena was.

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By: John Meadows https://isource.com/2010/01/02/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/#comment-17974 Sat, 02 Jan 2010 23:27:11 +0000 http://isource.com/iphone-app-store/more-ways-to-get-apps-on-the-iphone-no-thank-you/%20#comment-17974 I'm not sure your position makes sense; jailbreaking one's iPhone is not something the typical iPhone user will be willing to do, so for all practical purposes, that means that most users are limited to whatever applications make it past Apple's inconsistent and often seemingly capricious approval process. Are hacking your phone or not being able to get the most of the technology you pay for the only two alternatives?

While the App store control model may have been OK in the pre-smartphone era, the iPhone blurs the line between phone and portable computer, and it irks me that while I can install whatever I want on my other portable computing devices, unless I jailbreak I do not have that option with Apple. People have been able to use whatever software distribution methods for other platforms (including other Apple platforms) and the world hasn't come to an end.

Apple, what are you afraid of?

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